First attempt at milking

[dsimas]

Edie had her first calf on Monday, one week ago. I got her with milking as the goal, so this is what I've been waiting for. ;D I raised her from a weanling and she's comfy with leading, grooming, the stanchion, udder wash, everything. She's never kicked and is very sweet.

I tried to milk out some colostrum the first day, but got nothing but a few squirts. Since it was the first time for both of us (although I've handmilked a goat for a few months), she picked up her foot and fussed a bit, wasn't in the stanchion at that moment, and was confused with what I was doing, so I simply gave up until I could do it properly in the stanchion.

Unfortunately, last Thursday, the calf got overheated in the sunshine and we almost lost him. The vet came and he was reviving and she wanted to get some milk in him in case he was dehydrated. She was a horse vet and never had experienced a let down issue. I was not home for the emergency call, my Mom was, so they put her in the stanchion, and Edie wouldn't let down for her and started fighting the stanchion. It wasn't a good first attempt. She got about 1/2 cup after 20 minutes and gave up. I told them to not give Edie her calf back if he indeed was okay, and when I got home about 2 hours later, I tried again, to no avail. A puddle in the bucket was all I got. Although no fight, very happy to be groomed and eat, but not letting down. Since the calf had a rough day, I couldn't play hardball with her, so I left her for about 45 minutes and then released the calf to her later that night.

I want to be careful to not have a letdown issue. I see it seems most often in sharemilking, the cow won't let down, and I've been advised to be prepared to not give her the calf back until she gives it all to me.

So, today I thought I had better be sure that the calf can nurse from a bottle just in case I am forced to do that for a feeding or two when I try to milk Edie next. He's been separated from her for 6 hours and I tried a bottle with milk replacer. He took some of it, I backed him in a corner between my legs and he had no choice, wasn't happy but did actually suck on it for a few seconds, so he does know what's in it. I just don't think he was hungry enough?

Shall I try to milk Edie tonight and not release the calf yet? And then try to bottle feed him again later when he's hungrier? Oh! Maybe I'm being a pessimist... I should assume that Edie will let down for me and he can be with her tonight.

My question is:

Should I separate them long enough (8 hours? 12 hours?) to get him hungry enough to be sure that he *will* nurse from a bottle before I start with Edie? I don't want her to not let down and then be stuck *having* to give her the calf because he won't eat any other way...

Any suggestions are greatly appreciated!!

Dawn

[dsimas]

UPDATE:

Sam (calf) was in the cool barn for 7 hours this afternoon and Edie's bag was so swollen and huge, I don't know if she *could* have held up on me. She was at my back door bellering for help and wanted her baby back after about 5 hours. Sort of the reverse of what you would think, she wasn't as bothered at first with the separation as she was later because her udder was uncomfortable. So, I put her in the stanchion, washed her good, and she let down perfectly for the entire time. Our first time!! She was a bit agitated because she wanted Sam, but only by her head craning and looking for him. No tail swishing, no kicking, no holding up. WHEW. Only thing was that she has a cut on one front teat that he did with his teeth. I can't believe the teeth he has at one week old! So, I left that one alone. And her back teats are so short, they are only two fingers for me. But I double handed her on the left quarters until my hands wore out, had foam in the bucket. I didn't strip her. She had much more, but my hands wore out and I wanted to end on a good note. When my hands get tired, it goes slower, and I didn't want to test her patience and have her stop her let down and then I'd have to quit and that timing would have been bad. This way, she let down, I milked, she got let loose and everyone was happy. No cream yet, but we'll get this down after a few days and I feel much better that she's going to be a great little milk cow along with a fantastic mother.

[Star Creek Dexters]

Awesome! I am so happy for you!

In the future if you have problems getting her to let down, first tie Sam in front of her, where she can see and smell him, but he cannot get to her bag. If she still won't let down, bring him around the side or in back and let him nurse for a minute, pull him off and try to milk. She should let down pretty easy that way.

Hopefully you won't have to do this and she will just get used to the routine of a full bag means 'I need Dawn to come milk me!'

[dsimas]

Hi Kim!

Thank you, I was so excited. I've waited over two years for this. ;D

My biggest fear was caused by what you suggest with a friend's dexter cow. She also got her heifer for milking and raised her and she delivered her first calf 5 months ago. Held up on her and she tied the calf by her head. She'd milk a bit, but then the cow would start holding up and she'd put the calf on to get her going again. Just like you describe. The problem in retrospect, and also from some KFC people pointing it out: She was inadvertantly rewarding her cow for holding up by giving her the calf. So, it has gotten to the point that she cannot milk her without the calf on another teat, and that calf is getting big and a nuisance. So, now she's going to try to wean the calf entirely and retrain the cow, but she's had a long battle. I have learned from her misfortune. I'm sure some cows do fine with that method, but hers was so smart and figured out how to train her owner! So, many people said *do not* give her Sam back until she lets down for me. Even if it meant bottle feeding him for a while until she learns that the only way she'll get what she wants is if she gives me what I want.

That's why I was trying to get Sam to bottle feed today. So that I would know he would when I decided to start paying hardball with his mother! But, thankfully, it may not ever come to that. Such a relief!

I've heard that the reason that we have more let down issues with Dexters is that they are a heritage breed. All those great hardy, dual purpose qualities of being a cow that hasn't been messed with with modern selective specialized breeding. Dairy cows have had their maternal instincts reduced through selective breeding. If you have a dairy cow that won't let down without her baby, you cull her and she doesn't reproduce. Sort of like how my Leghorn chickens never get broody like my heritage breeds. Broodiness has been bred out of them in order to produce more yield in factories. Makes sense to me. So, even though I may be in for a bit more training and struggle to milk my Dexter, it's worth it for the advantages of their great heritage qualities!

Dawn

[Star Creek Dexters]

Dawn,
Thanks for all the info. I guess my Lana has me spoiled. She's never tried to hold up on me, not even when we still had her calf.

I think your theory on Heritage Breeds is interesting. I think it depends a lot on the animal and the training and the blood lines. But I certainly agree about the dairy breeds being bred into a work animal.

Your hands will build up fast. The first two weeks I thought mine were just gonna fall off, milking 1.5 gallons, 2 x's a day. But now I don't even think about it, just rest my head on her flank and get lost in my thoughts. My husband laughs cause I call it my 'me time'. It's the only time of the day I am all by myself without little ones gathered around me saying 'Mommy, Mommy, Mommy!'

Good luck! Keep us posted on how it's going!

[dsimas]

Thanks for the encouragement Kim! Yes, you are blessed with Lana, that's for sure. I've heard of many dexters with let down issues.

So, this morning was our second milking ever. Edie was a dream. I didn't even separate her from Sam last night, but when I went out this morning, I figured to give it a go. I locked Sam in the stall next to the stanchion and put her in the headgate, washed her, milked her, cleaned her up and released her like we've done it forever. She never even picked up a foot or swished her tail. ;D

I got only one quart. But, her teats are small and my hands were tired! So I am glad to hear that I will get better as we continue. I cannot even fathom 1.5 gallons in one milking. I left one quarter alone since she still has the cut healing on that teat. But it felt like I stripped the other 3, which weren't even full since he was on her all night. So, I'm curious if she let down her cream or not for me, I guess I'll find out when I look at the jar later. Or can you tell when you are milking if you are getting that cream in the end?

But I am thrilled at my little jarfull. I have to restrain myself to not open the fridge to keep looking at it proudly.



By the way, the regular cow vet is coming out tomorrow to give Sam a VitE/Selenium shot to see if he can handle the sun better and give him a checkup. Hopefully, I don't have to continue locking him inthe barn in the afternoons to keep him cool.

[Star Creek Dexters]

You should be proud! It's a lot of work, but there is something so very rewarding about seeing that milk in a jar! I think it's beautiful!
If you want the cream to rise faster, you can pop it in your freezer for an hour or two, just don't forget it, because, unless you leave about an inch of head space, you will break your jar. Ask me how I know this

Right now I think we have about 12 gallons of frozen milk in the freezer. Last night my husband was helping me strain the milk. He took it to the freezer and came back out with this lop-sided grin. I said "What?' and he said he was just thinking how many hundreds of thousands of squirts my hands did to get all that milk. I thought it was a funny thought =)

[stonehillfarm]

Hi there,
I'm Dawn's friend whose cow won't let down unless I bring the calf on! And it's been 5 months and my hands are still hurting! I have read something about it being necessary to have a 60-90 second span of stimulation of her udder before she'll let down, so what I started doing is bringing the calf down, but not letting her on mom... tying her up by mom's head, clean, strip, dip and dry her udder... taking about 60-90 seconds and then milk out what I can get (this is very difficult as I can tell her udder and teats have not softened, but her bag is full so I can get some out) then she stops letting me get any milk out, but I can feel that her udder is still hard, so I bring on the calf and let the calf suck and soon see her teats soften and fill and then I remove the calf dip and dry and the milk gushes! and it's easy! I want to keep the calf on for now, because we have to go away for a weekend and I'd like to know that she'll be ok, but I'd really like it if she let down for me! Any tricks or ointments?

Thanks!

[Star Creek Dexters]

HI,
Wow, that is an impressive ability to hold up =) Cows are so funny.

I personally haven't had any problems with hold up, but we lost my Lana's calf at 4 days old, so that may be the reason. Here are a couple of suggestions:
First off, to help with sore hands and/or numb hands, try really beefing up your vit b complex, take a really good supplement, even a liquid, if you can get one. Several experienced milkers told me this, and it helped so much! I also milk 3 nanny goats, at about 1.5 gallons a day, so when we added Miss Lana's 3 gallons, there in the beginning I walked around like I had crippled hands. I actually cried the first couple of days...4.5 gallons of milk is a lot of milk to get out in one day ;P BUt I remembered when I got my first goat and she was giving 1 gallon a day on tad milking, I thought that my hands were gonna fall off! So, my advice, 1. Take your b, 2. think of yourself as an athlete in training, a little pain, a little gain =)

On to milking, One thing I have heard that really works for some of the hardest to let down cows is a warm oil massage right before milking. Warm some olive or coconut oil, maybe mix in a little peppermint oil to help relax your girl, and message the whole udder. Start with the top and work you way down. Don't beat her up, but don't go super gentle either. You know how a calf 'bumps' the udder to get let down? Use your fist to 'bump' her bag. After you get her all messaged, start milking.

When I start milking Lana she is hard on top, soft on bottom. I start by getting the first squirts on the ground, then bring the pail over and milk in quick short squirts until I feel her udder and bag go HARD, then I know that she is letting down. Once this happens the real work of milking sets in. All that milk has rushed into the bag and it's kinda hard to get out at first, her teats are swollen and hard and I have to really work it. After about 10 mins they are back to soft and easy to milk.

One other thought, how long are you separating Momma and calf for? Rule of thumb is no less than 6, no more than 12. How old is your calf?

Keep me posted! =)