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Post by legendrockranch on Jan 21, 2011 22:21:05 GMT -5
I'd be happy with those results Kim. Are you?
Barb
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Post by Star Creek Dexters on Jan 22, 2011 6:51:41 GMT -5
Yes, I am. I am just glad to know more than anything. I don't think my Madi carries red. It's know where in her back ground, so chances are our next calf will be dun or black.
Lana will most likely calve black and Leah could calve black or red. It's nice to know where I stand.
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Post by cddexter on Jan 22, 2011 15:41:55 GMT -5
Hi Kim, wow, you've GOT IT. you can take over being the color guru! ;D
People are so used to instand communication, it's easy to forget how new all this info and testing is. Back when ('97), there were only two places in North America that did color testing, and the cost was $60 each test. I was just thinking about all the 'oh it's so expensive to test' comments that have been flying around lately, and had to smile. I must have put out almost $2,000...not to test my own animals, but to learn how colors worked with the Dexter breed, and that was just for E+.
Glad to know these posts have helped you. regards, c.
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Post by legendrockranch on Jan 22, 2011 19:07:50 GMT -5
Hi Kim, wow, you've GOT IT. you can take over being the color guru! ;D No she can't c, we need you! No offense Kim  I have to admit even to me it can be confusing sometimes. All I want are the "E+" and the "e". My fondness is for the animals that have the "E+", because I like the black noses, but heck in reality it's just a color. Barb |
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Post by legendrockranch on Jan 22, 2011 22:30:52 GMT -5
Well maybe I wasn't specific enough in what I said.
e/e noses are normally real pinkish in color. As where E+/e and E+/E+ noses for the most can run the gamut from pinkish color with black speckles, or almost a purplish color to real black.
It's not limited to the nose either, it can show like black eyeliner around the animals eyes or having a black vulva area.
Kimberly can you get a close-up shot of Koopers nose?
Gene I really can't see Fermoys nose close enough to see if it's speckled. Could you take a closer picture also.
Carol (c) care to comment?
Barb
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Post by marion on Jan 22, 2011 23:21:16 GMT -5
I have a theory that brindling is tied to E+. It is in some other breeds. Gene, You dont need a theory. Brindle needs an E+ allele to express. If in doubt about the genetics of brindle expression in Dexters, ask John Potter. Also, see Sheila Schmutz article: homepage.usask.ca/~schmutz/CowPatterns.html..marion |
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Post by cddexter on Jan 23, 2011 0:24:31 GMT -5
Well maybe I wasn't specific enough in what I said. Barb Barb, there's just too many variables. I've seen ee animals in every shade of red, some with black faces, legs and tails, but all have had pink noses. My understanding is that you only get black or spotted or freckled or other than pink (e AND E+) and taupe (bb) with E+. I've even seen a black/red roan purebred Dexter. Think of the consternation if I'd bought and collected him instead of Outlaw. I've never heard of brindle being expressed in anything other than E+ base color animals. Dexters confound the experts all the time....John's had some animals, with dna test proofs, that don't follow Sheila's website observations. However, she's so knowledgeable, I'd always defer to her as my first move. Scientists question everything: it's what they're supposed to do. Sheila wouldn't believe E+ could be red until I provided test results, photos, and 137 proven offspring of a father/son combo, where the father was RED E+E+ b?, and the son was DUN E+B bb. Even then, the scientist who's credited with discovering the base locus really didn't believe me, as he hadn't seen it himself. It was quite a while later that Hereford's were proven to carry E+ and as 'EVERYONE KNOWS', all Hereford's are red, that my findings were finally accepted. Skepticism is a healthy litmus test. c. |
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Post by ctownson on Jan 23, 2011 4:45:44 GMT -5
Barb, I will have to get a close up of Midas so we can see his nose. He is E+/E+ B/b, wild red and carries dun. He is the only one of our herd we have color tested, although I know a number of our cows carry red and/or dun based on their sire or dam.
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Post by Star Creek Dexters on Jan 23, 2011 7:31:56 GMT -5
This is really interesting. Kooper's pink. Will post a pic. But Glory, Kooper's daughter, who's mother was black but carried red, maybe E+, has a much darker nose, dark pink with black spots. The older she gets the darker it gets. Will have to see if I can find some recent pics, as she's staying with a friend right now.
Carol, I have NO ambision to take over color guru! I have so much to learn, and it all still makes my head spin! =)
I have to say I totally agree with you about the test. I know that getting into a registered animal and being a responsible breeder is going to take more out put than buying a couple of feeder cows and sticking them out in the field. This breed is very special to me, I love them. It is worth the out put to me and we counted the cost before we made our initial purchase. And further, it's a real blessing that we have the ability to know the answer's to all these questions. We can be informed breeders, and take the steps to make our own herd into an expression of the Dexter breed. With out the genetic tests available, I can't imagine the loss and heart break one could endure to establish a herd. I, for one, am very happy that I can know what I have, make informed choices regarding what I want to breed in my herd, eliminate the needless losses, and even get to know what possible color my calves will be!
Thanks for all the help! This has been a great learning tool!
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Post by Star Creek Dexters on Jan 23, 2011 7:40:52 GMT -5
Kooper's nose:  Glory's nose, a couple of months ago:  |
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Post by cddexter on Jan 23, 2011 7:40:52 GMT -5
oh, and here I was thinking I could safely leave it all in your hands. Pity. lol.
if you think color is nice to have, just think how incredibly helpful it is to have a chondro test. No more 'I have a proportionate shortleg' bs. cheers. c.
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Post by Star Creek Dexters on Jan 23, 2011 7:43:42 GMT -5
Yes! my point exactly! =)
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Post by ctownson on Jan 23, 2011 9:02:05 GMT -5
Here is Midas for comparison purposes.   |
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Post by legendrockranch on Jan 23, 2011 11:13:14 GMT -5
Modified to thank c for the info. Don't we talk about interesting subjects on this forum. Nice pictures everyone thanks for taking the time to put them up. Charles, Midas nose looks speckled in the pictures to me. Kimberly, Glorys nose is what I would expect from an animal that could be E+/e or E+/E+. As for Kooper, geesh Kim couldn't you wash his nose first before taking the pictures? ;D ;D  The speckles normally are very small, like those on Midas. As I mentioned earlier, E+ seems to express itself in various ranges, and shades of colors. I think I have one animal that could be e/e, I'll go out and look at him. Sure wish John P, was on this forum, he's been looking at nose coloring for a long time. I know several years ago I sent him lots of photos of Dexter noses. Now if you all really want a laugh, at my expense. I'm actually red/green color blind. So who know what color I really see!  Barb |
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Post by legendrockranch on Jan 23, 2011 14:05:31 GMT -5
Once again there is going to be some more clarifications on the color nose questions with some help from my friends. As soon as I can I'll post the info.
Barb
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