Extra skin on belly, like a bull?

[sleepyowl]

Maybe the pictures that I saw are just extreme cases of "outies"? *dunno*

[Deleted]

Oh Ian, now I see what you mean................and agree with where you are coming from now re breeding

[tarsallat]

Agree with you guys it's a fault. Loose navel equals loose sheath, equals trouble. Downward pointing penis also equals broken penis . A cow with a loose navel will pass that gene onto her bull calves too. Why accept it if you don't have too, there are better bulls without loose sheaths to chose from. Only breed from lose navel cows for meat cattle, don't keep any bulls from her. Ask any cattleman, it's a fault and a serious one.
Also hernias are rare in cattle, and that's a fault too, takes genetic tendency to get a hernia, means a weak stomach wall muscle, it's polygenic. Just an excuse saying it's a rough birth to cover a genetic fault.

[cddexter]

Actually, there IS a relationship between reproductive aspects. Good cattlemen will tell you the shape and size of the scrotum and testicles has a direct bearing on the shape and attachment of the udder and visa versa.. One of the evaluation courses I took, we looked at a commercial dairy herd (mechanically milked, never suckled). Instructor saw uneven udders (one side lower than the other), and said to the owner, is the sire on the farm? Owner said yes. Instructor said: let's go take a look. I predict his scrotum will be uneven.

Guess what? yup.

Same thing with suspension. We've all talked here a lot of times about suspensory relationships between the udder and the scrotum.

Don't sell short the idea that a lot of these things are inheritable. cheers, c.

[Deleted]

Jul 16, 2013 3:54:14 GMT -5 tarsallat said:

Also hernias are rare in cattle, and that's a fault too, takes genetic tendency to get a hernia, means a weak stomach wall muscle, it's polygenic. Just an excuse saying it's a rough birth to cover a genetic fault.

Not everything is black and white and that's what I hope to bring to the discussions I have here.

There are always variances and genetics do not perform 100% as they should all of the time whether its in a positive or negative determination.

There are instances where issues come to light that have no genetic basis but can be results of circumstances at the time.

I choose not to be dogmatic about these things instead try and understand the variances, and learn from it.

[mogenmoos]

Sorry I missed this conversation. We tend to pick or like cows with a dairy look, and all of our cows have an enlarged navel flap ( belly button). Don't know why, but our whole herd ended up that way. Our good friends herd seems to be almost belly button free, and they have some nice looking beefy animals.

Our daughter Kylee, started to question if a belly button is a good thing, a bad thing or if it should be a concern at all. We have not had any reproductive issues, including loose sheaths, or problems with calving. In Kylee's research, commercial cattlemen do not like belly buttons, they told her it causes problems. She asked what kind of problems, they could not answer. Our vet, told her he did not like belly buttons, but said that was his personal opinion.  Kylee did find several cases online that led her to believe that an enlarged belly button is associated with heritage (original cattle genetics) and good milk production. In one case, in the early 1900's at the University of South Dakota, the dairy judges score card gave 1 point for for a belly button. In India the farmers had no scientific proof, but in one study, the farmers said that the cows with belly buttons produced more milk. In that study, they looked at reproduction and spring of rib as well.

Kylee has started a study, measuring the navel flap at birth, along with height, weight, heart girth, and with of hips and pins. As the calf develops she will also look at, spring of rib, reproductive issues and milk production. She plans to have a 4 year study. We have no idea what or if this study will tell us anything, but we have to start somewhere. If you would like to help out, let us know. The more information the better.

I agree, the best thing for the Dexter Breed is to breed quality cattle, and cull the rest. A loose sheath, an bad udder, bad feet, cow hocked are all no no's. If you start with excellent breeding stock, you will end up with excellent cattle.

Kristi
silversagehomestead

[otf]

Mogenmoos, I copied this from your website:

"All heifers or cows for sale from Silver Sage Homestead will be A2/A2 or spayed."

From what I've read, spaying is usually performed on young heifers in the food chain. I've never heard of anyone spaying their Dexter because she is not A2/A2! Sounds pretty extreme to me. I don't know the Dexter market in your area, but cannot imagine there are no buyers of breeding A1/A2 cows out there. You've got nice bloodlines. Why, oh why spay?

For what it's worth, none of the cows pictured on your website demonstrate an excess of skin in the umbilical area.