When do you breed back?

[zephyrhillsusan]

Up till now, when we bred a cow back was dependent on when we could get the AI tech to finally answer our calls, when we found a bull that had room in his schedule for one of our girls to visit, or when it came our turn at an on-farm lease bull.  That has all changed with the arrival of our future herd sire!    He's only seven months old, but I'm trying to plan for the future.

We definitely like spring calving.  After the incredible cold spells this winter, I'm especially glad our calves are due in the spring.  Our vet is a good 45 minutes away up and down several mountains, and I like to know that he could get here if needed.  Not to mention, I don't want to be checking cows at night in the kind of weather we've just had.  So . . .

Macree will be 15 months old in August; I don't plan to breed her until late August or early September for a June 2015 calf, around her second birthday.  That's if we don't sell her before then.

As far as the cows, Ebony is due on April 13. Siobhan is due on May 20.

My question is about how you decide when to breed your cows back?  I know some of you keep your bull with your cows year-round and let him breed them back when he wants.  I lean more toward having some input into things.    I know some people breed back right away, and some prefer to give the cow a couple months of rest.  What are the pros and cons of each?

I know a lot of milkers breed for one calf in spring and one in fall for year-round milk, but if I was going to do that I would have to wait to breed one of the girls until December of this year, and I don't like waiting that long.  I'm thinking that if I put both girls in with Royal in July (giving Ebony, whom I'll be milking, 3 months rest and Siobhan, whom I won't be milking, two months).  So if all goes well, we would be looking at two April 2015 calves.  Might be easier to have the vet do immunizations all at once, as well as dehorning if necessary?  Not to mention, none of our calves has ever had an age-appropriate friend, and I think it would be so much fun for them if they did.

I'd appreciate any thoughts/experiences you all have.  I'm just trying to make sure I think of all the angles, potential problems, pros and cons since this is a new situation for us.

[lakeportfarms]

Like Gene, we just let it happen when it's going to happen.  Myself, I prefer calving late fall, for us around late October.  I like calving the least in the early/mid spring months (April) when it is cold, wet, and muddy, with mid to late summer heat and flies a close second.  What months of course depends on your climate, as Georgia is going to be a lot different than Michigan in what you're going to encounter weather wise.

Also as Gene mentioned, there is a good chance that in the lifespan of your cow you'll have an extra calf or in the most extreme cases two  by allowing the breedings to occur naturally.  We've had one move from July to November already (10 months between calves consistently). She's in great condition.  I think it's more important to observe the activity in the herd as much as possible and then be diligent about keeping track of dates your cows are expected to calve than worrying about the schedule.  I also think a bull kept with his cows is a happier bull in the long run.  I know your new bull is just a youngster, but when he gets older do you think he's going to be happy across the fence line from that cow that is being mounted by the other cows for three months while he waits? 

[Fran]

Not that I have a lot of experience (only had 4 born at our farm), but I prefer the cooler weather births (because our winters are typically not too bad). Our cow barn is a shed row type barn. Mom & baby are stalled for the first 24-36 hours, then out during the day and stalled at night for a couple of nights. Just want to make sure that babies have their legs under them good. We have lots and lots of coyotes. I do not keep the bull in with the heavy pregnant cows, but he is in with the others. I usually let the bull back with them after a month, unless I don't want calving at a certain time.

[zephyrhillsusan]

Gene, I'm lazy about math so I've been using a gestation table that I found on Silver Maples' website.  It allows me to find a calving date according to breeding date or to choose a target breeding date according to when I'd like a calf.  Of course I know the animals are going to have their own timing and the dates could go 10 days to two weeks either way.  And yes, I prefer early spring because the flies were really bad when Macree was born in June last year.  But down here we have flies into November.  

Your point about how happy the bull is going to be waiting across the fence for 3 months, Hans, is exactly why I asked this question.  As a baby, he's content to gaze at the cows across the driveway in the barnyard, although the heifer keeps mooing at him with these little moos--the bovine version of making sheep's eyes, I assume.     But obviously that's going to change!  I also see that monitoring each cow's individual condition is necessary, and I like your option, Sheri, of separating one cow out with the steers if necessary.  We have four pastures, working on fencing a fifth one, but I wouldn't count on a couple of the older fences to keep a bull from a cow he wanted to breed.  So if we do separate any animals it will definitely constrain the use of our pastures and restrict rotating the animals.

Thanks so much for your thoughts, you all.  That being said, does anyone out there do it differently?  I love to get input!  Or just call me nosy . . .  

[zephyrhillsusan]

Fran, it took me so long to type that post while sipping coffee that you had replied before I finished. More good thoughts! We have the barnyard where I like to put cows who are ready to calve, and keep them under my eyes like you do after the calf is born. I also like to handle them early on. With the one pasture right across the driveway fenced with horse fencing and our LGD on guard, no reason a cow can't stay there until she's ready to join the bull. So now all I have to decide is whether to put them back for calf heat or wait like you do. It seems to me it's a choice between more calves over a cow's lifetime vs. giving the cows a bit of a rest, and certainly some will need that more than others at certain times. Farming isn't a life of endless routine, but of constantly adaptive and hopefully intelligent husbandry! It's kind of like learning and then becoming fluent in a new language.  

[dexterfarm]

I bread for early spring. I don't milk in the winter just to cold here and I do not want calves born in the cold. Bull goes in June and stays with the cows until. the end of the year. Most bread right away some heifers take a little longer so they end up calving later. for me doesn't matter if they calved in march or may they sill go back with the bull in June. Also most of my summer pasture is away from my house. So they calve when I have them here to keep an eye on. By the time they go to summer pastures they have a good start.
As far as the bull being separated . He is never alone. He is with other bull calves and sometimes pregnant cows.