Chondro positive: Is he or isn't he?

[wagradexters]

Susan, your "redneck" has parallels in our backwoods regions. When I came here 30 years ago I learned that this triangle of remote villages had recently been officially deemed to have a narrower gene pool than what had previously been believed to be the most inbred community in Au. The visiting nurse told me that a prominent sternum was evident among members of the old families around here. On the other side of the world, my late-ex-father-in-law's documentation indicated that his parents were first cousins, Krakow, Poland early 1900s.

Clans, tribes, breeds,...all makes Woodmagic breeding appear to be quite the norm really doesn't it.
Margaret
Au

[Deleted]

I would wait to band him, red and polled, and sweet. He sure is a handsome boy. No guess on his Chrondo status.

[zephyrhillsusan]

carragheendexters, here goes on your photos.  

As a guess from the photos you have , yes, he is chondro positive.
Look at his ratio from withers to ground : withers to tailhead, he is square. Then compare to Macree, her ratio from withers to ground : withers to tailhead, she is taller than she is long, like a rectangle on its end. (This goes by the way though when you are looking at animals that are genetically short legged without being chondro positive, such as those bred from Woodmagic) Also from the profile photo of his head, his little turned-up nose and dished face, like an Arab. I find this look more pronounced in chondro carriers compared to non-carriers.

Read more: dextercattle.proboards.com/thread/4112/chondro-positive#ixzz33AYt9HG5

I'm going back and putting previous comments with the photos because I think it helps those of us who aren't used to this kind of evaluation.  I went back and looked at the second photo of Tiggy and could definitely see that she makes a tall rectangle instead of a square.  Very interesting!  It's much easier for me to do this with photos than in real life--they move too fast!  



Louise, I'm not sure what to be looking for here with the topside photo.  I hope I wasn't too much over to one side.

If you look front on, non-chondro have that look of both of their front legs "coming out of the one hole" (doggy term for narrow fronted) whereas the chondro pos have wider shoulders and space between their front legs.

Read more: dextercattle.proboards.com/thread/4112/chondro-positive#ixzz33AX9FT8c

Well, hmm, maybe positive?  It really helps to read the comments while looking at the photos.  


(BTW,do you think his feet look a bit funny?  Almost like he's walking on the outside edge of his front hooves?  You can sort of see it in the top photo, too.  His one knee was a bit wobbly and wanting to knuckle forward this evening, but he's only two days old and he was probably tired, so I'm hoping he'll grow out of it.)

Yes, we'll definitely wait to band him!    We walked right up to him tonight, and he let us touch him and even let us lead him a bit.  At two days old we had to catch Tiggy in the corner of the barnyard, and she still runs from us even after seeing us at least twice a day for six weeks!

[carragheendexters]

May 29, 2014 23:28:45 GMT -5 zephyrhillsusan said:

carragheendexters, here goes on your photos.  





(BTW,do you think his feet look a bit funny?  Almost like he's walking on the outside edge of his front hooves?  You can sort of see it in the top photo, too.  His one knee was a bit wobbly and wanting to knuckle forward this evening, but he's only two days old and he was probably tired, so I'm hoping he'll grow out of it.)

 You are observant Susan, many wouldn't have noticed that in their calf. I have found that is a characteristic of chondro pos calves. Mine do that also. I wouldn't worry about it. As they grow their legs straighten out and they soon walk normally, just takes a few weeks. It's my opinion that it is because of the way their shoulder is constructed because of the chondro, it's the way the scapula angle lays against the body, as their bodies are rounder and wider. See how his legs are wide in front with quite a bit of space in the brisket between them?

Over the top see how he is fairly wide and the same width all the way through?

New calves do knuckle over at the knee sometimes, their legs do strengthen as they use them, the ligaments just need to tighten up with use. Remember they have been cramped up in a uterus for so long and can't straighten or weight bear on their legs, so they are not used to walking on them.

Now remember this is just me having a guess at his status, but I'm still going chondro carrier. I do think though that he will grow to have fairly long legs, I don't think that he will be extreme. My thoughts are that you can't really go by length of leg to decide whether or not they are carriers. it is the whole picture.

I am sure that there are probably lots of non-carriers that also may have these characteristics, so I am probably wrong, but his type is a lot like our newborn carriers, and this is what I go on. Our carriers are a bit longer on the leg and not extreme. Many wouldn't pick them as carriers. Mind you I also have some that are very short in the leg and they are non-carriers, that is why all of ours are tested to back up my guessing.

[carragheendexters]

Hmmm Margaret, we know about those mountain men where you live LOL. Do they have any genetic health issues? I wonder what their inbreeding coefficient is?
Did you know that all cheetahs are genetically the same, that is the same when DNA'd. It is thought that is because all cheetahs came from 2 original animals, which some use as evidence to back up the story of the ark.

[lakeportfarms]

Louise, you are right on the money about the "wobbly leg" effect of chondro the first few days after they are born. We've noticed that in many of our calves and is one of the major clues we look for. Some, usually the more extreme carriers, are more than others, but we usually have more extreme carriers so it's easy to spot.

Susan, seeing the newest photos, I'd also say chondro positive, however he'll have less exaggerated characteristics if he is.

[zephyrhillsusan]

Well, the test results are in, and he is! He tested N/BD1 (chondro positive). Thanks to all of you who played the game!
E+/e (wild red & recessive red).
Pc/H (Heterozygous polled).
Still waiting on the A2 and other milk tests. I figured, why not do them? (I know all of you know what the test letters mean, but included the interpretation for newcomers.)

This little guy is such a sweetheart! He's having a bout of colitis X (our vet called it), and DH and I made an emergency 90-mile round trip to the vet tonight to get him treated. (I'll post about it on my blog tomorrow. As soon as I get his probiotics into him as ordered at 11:30, I'm going to bed!) Wellie rode standing up on the back seat of the truck with me holding him the entire trip there. I have a few claw-shaped bruises on my thighs to show for it. But he was looking out the window and quite curious, not at all frightened. Several times he touched his nose to my face or licked my arm. The vet was quite impressed by him, said he's nice and stocky and couldn't believe how calm he was. After he got all his meds, Wellie made friends with the farm dog. He got some banamine in him and felt better, so he laid down on my lap for the ride home and stayed there the whole time. Although I was worried about him, once the vet said he'll do fine, I was able to enjoy the experience. Both Herb and I thought it was a very special time, almost ethereal. The drive was beautiful, the vet was so gracious about missing an outing with his family, we were treated to a fabulous sunset and rainbow on the drive home, and Wellie just laid on my lap and dozed like a cat while I petted him. We may never again have that experience, but it was one I'm glad we could share.

Some lovely people that we know who own a little petting zoo are thinking of getting a miniature cow for the zoo. They're looking for a friendly one who would enjoy the kids, and they're interested in Wellie. I'm partly glad because he would be great for that, but sad because he would be castrated (no matter how nice a bull is, he doesn't belong in a children's petting zoo!), and I think he would make such a marvelous, laid-back bull. But then again, he might have an even longer life with these people than many bulls do, and they take marvelous care of their animals. After the way he took to the truck ride tonight, I think he'd be a perfect traveling companion and a great ambassador for Dexters. So I guess we'll see . . .

[zephyrhillsusan]

Wellie posed for me out in the pasture recently, and I thought it might be fun to update this thread with a photo of what he looks like now at 17 months old.  The home with the petting zoo fell through, so he will be our beef steer for next year.  It will be our first time to ever butcher one we bred and raised from birth, so that will be hard.     I'm really pleased with how he's looking, and I'm trying to prepare myself for the inevitable by thinking cuts of beef when I look at him.    He's a sweet, good-natured guy, so he's not going to make it easy on us!

[hollydzie]

Susan, he is handsome for sure. The first one we had born and raised on our farm was difficult. I must admit the first time I used the meat I felt a little strange. I got over It quickly . We are taking our third one tomorrow morning, an extremely nice heifer who has had fertility issues and will never be able to be bred. I have put off as long as I can, at this point I am ready. You will do fine when the time comes, you have cared for him better than anyone ever would have and he will bless you in return.
Holly