zephyrhillsusan
member
Caught Dexteritis in Dec. 2009. Member of this forum since Oct. 2013.
Posts: 1,502
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Post by zephyrhillsusan on Jul 22, 2015 9:01:25 GMT -5
I contacted the ADCA and have been told that the line "All rights reserved. Unauthorized duplication prohibited." was put there to cover the content. The content is private and cannot be duplicated.
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Post by cddexter on Jul 22, 2015 9:19:35 GMT -5
Uh, sheri, does the word ethics come to your mind at all? In this permissive society, we can all pretty well do whatever we like, providing (a) we don't get caught, and/or (b) no one complains. You'd have to have been there, but Rosemary Fleharty refused (as in threw a hissy fit) to act on an ADCA Board directive to complete the back entries for the ADCA database. Her reason? She was afraid it would be hi-jacked. Rosemary's biggest and most public supporter was Judy Sponaugle. And now Rosemary's fears are realized, and from the one person she thought she could count on. Yep, all pretty funny. c.
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Post by dexterfarm on Jul 22, 2015 9:33:10 GMT -5
I dont get why anyone cares. You people need to find something better to do with your time. I took a look at it there is nothing that indicates these animals are registered with Legacy. This is in a separate section from the Legacy registered animals. They clearly indicate that they are registered with ADCA and have the ADCA registration number and ADCA info. If anything this promotes your animals and the ADCA. We are all in the business of breeding and selling registered stock. That means the pedigrees are public. What is the point of raising registered animals if you want the pedigrees hidden and locked away some where. Just to get this strait you pay good money to publish a pedigree but then dont want anyone to see it? ya that makes sense.
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Post by Cascade Meadows Farm - Kirk on Jul 22, 2015 9:46:16 GMT -5
"Copy Right Reserved" means you can look at the data, and you can even link to the data, but you can't take a copy of the data and republish it on your own website without permission.
It's interesting that when I linked to a picture in the legacy database in a discussion board (100% legal because I didn't make a copy) some of the legacy people threatened to sue me for copyright infringement.
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Post by lakeportfarms on Jul 22, 2015 10:16:31 GMT -5
Why do I get the feeling that Hans you might have had your hands involved in this? If you think I had a hand in this, your paranoia is getting the better of you. I have far better things to do with my time than messing with you or others. Go volunteer at a children's cancer hospital or something to gain a little perspective in your life.
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Post by legendrockranch on Jul 22, 2015 11:08:48 GMT -5
Why do I get the feeling that Hans you might have had your hands involved in this? I have far better things to do with my time than messing with you or others. Doesn't sound like a denial to me. Maybe you should ask your cohort to spend her time more wisely. I find it interesting that you are taking this intrusion so lightly. As a side note, why does "Lakeportfarms" not come up as a poster at the bottom of the page, where it mentions people that have posted in the last 24 hours? Added after: Kirk I saw that comment also. Interesting enough it came out of the mouth of "Lakeportfarms, Hans. I believe his words were, copyright infringement lawsuit in regards to the picture you linked.
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Post by legendrockranch on Jul 22, 2015 11:51:41 GMT -5
I would like to pose this question to those of you who feel this is no big deal. Can you tell me what other information might have been taken that we are not aware of? This might not be a big deal to you, but for me it is because no matter how trivial you feel this information is, it does NOT belong to Judy or Legacy. What else is she capable of doing? Taking my information without asking should not be tolerated. It's call theft. Even if it was ok for her to use our information from the ADCA website she did not even have the courtesy to ask if I minded.
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Post by legendrockranch on Jul 22, 2015 12:18:39 GMT -5
Lakeport said to me: Go volunteer at a children's cancer hospital or something to gain a little perspective in your life
I find this comment extremely offensive. For you information my husband and I spent 36 years in the Military, many of those years I spent volunteering at hospitals for the wounded or clinics. I have more perspective about pain and suffering than you have in you pinkie. In fact just today we were are Brooke Army Medical center. Seeing burned soldiers, or soldiers with missing limbs is something I have seen MANY times it it truly heartbreating. Please be a little more careful when opening you mouth and spewing about something you have no knowledge of in regards to my life.
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Post by RedRidge on Jul 22, 2015 13:09:43 GMT -5
If I put something out on the Web, or permit it to be put out there, unless it is password protected (or encrupted, secure, etc) I consider that information public. I don't think ethics, or lack thereof, is even a consideration in this instance. WE permitted that information to be posted by registering. You don't like that certain info is publicly available? Take it up with the ADCA board. Now, if we were talking personal and confidential information - and let me remind you we were not... that would be different. We are not talking social security numbers or bank accounts here folks. For heavens sake, these are cattle. COWS! Not people. The ADCA can put what they want but their wording combined with the information they publicly display would never hold up in court. Everyone needs to cool their jets, put things in perspective, quit with the what if's, and stick to the facts. The bottom line is, there is nothing I have on the ADCA site that I didn't authorize to become public information by registering with the ADCA. If someone has some secret special cow or bull they don't want anyone to know anything about, then they don't need to be registering that animal anyway.
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Post by legendrockranch on Jul 22, 2015 13:26:12 GMT -5
- and let me remind you we were not... that would be different. We are not talking social security numbers or bank accounts here folks. Sorry Sheri, let me remind you that we DO NOT KNOW all or what was taken.
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Post by legendrockranch on Jul 22, 2015 13:37:14 GMT -5
Let's put this discussion to rest. It's in the hands of the ADCA and appropriate parties.
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Post by RedRidge on Jul 22, 2015 14:31:51 GMT -5
- and let me remind you we were not... that would be different. We are not talking social security numbers or bank accounts here folks. Sorry Sheri, let me remind you that we DO NOT KNOW all or what was taken. Nor do we have any reason to believe sensitive information was taken. Especially since sensitive information is not kept by the ADCA. I'm not defending or taking sides in either direction. More of a devils advocate. Just trying to remind everyone that assumptions and personal attacks aren't called for... from anyone.
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Post by jennyacres on Jul 22, 2015 14:31:55 GMT -5
Mike, Legacy has provided testing services for international customers and has Dexters from other countries in its genotype database -- but those animals are registered in their own country's Dexter cattle registries, they don't consider Legacy to be their registry, it is only a service that they used to get testing done at UC-Davis VGL at a discount. The issue with the Legacy genotype database trying to act as a Dexter breed registry is that it only requires that the sire and dam be registered with either the PDCA or the ADCA (or a foreign Dexter registry) and a genotype of the animal is done at UC-Davis VGL through Legacy testing services, that's it. The ADCA requires the sire genotype to be on file with the ADCA (and this has been an ADCA requirement since January 1, 2009) and the PDCA and Legacy do not have this requirement for registration. So the situation comes up where the sire is a PDCA registered Dexter and it isn't genotyped, or if it is genotyped, the sire's genotype is not submitted to the ADCA for entry into the ADCA genotype database. When this happens, the calf that is being submitted for ADCA registration isn't eligible for registration in the ADCA. That's what I'm referring to when I say that the Legacy genotype database falls short of meeting the ADCA registration requirements. These are just the facts of the situation as it has existed since 2009. Patti Patti, thanks for your comments and the calm and collected way you present your ideas. The situation you described above is one of the primary reasons I started this thread. I currently have some PDCA registered animals which fall in this category. Their Sire and Dam are registered in the ADCA, however, their Sire's genotype is not on file with the ADCA. We wish to appeal to a broad base of breeders and therefore chose to try and get them registered with the ADCA too. The owner of their Sire is working with us, but it has been a pain (apparently the first hair sample didn't contain enough hairs for UCD to complete the testing so back to square one) in the butt. I think the previous owner stopped registering with the ADCA because of the requirement for genotyping. Anyhow, it is this that caused me to ponder whether or not any benefit is to be had by maintaining more than one registry, especially when they seem to have the same ends in mind. I'll reiterate what I asked in my initial post: Lets please try to keep the conversation cordial with all parties maintaining an open mind and thick skin.
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Post by jennyacres on Jul 22, 2015 14:52:01 GMT -5
Regarding the listing of ADCA registry entries under Legacy, I think the frustration stems in part, not from the fact that public information is simply copied to another public area, but from the fact that an organization that describes itself as a competitor to the ADCA is using their copyrighted material to achieve its own ends.
At the risk of giving this more attention than it deserves, I'll continue. If instead of a database we were talking about a television show, say SouthPark (a controversial show for a controversial subject). And if FOX was playing the show without permission from Comedy Central we simply wouldn't be having this conversation: the ethical transgression seems clear here. Just because it exists on the internet doesn't mean anyone can use it to their own ends.
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Post by dexterfarm on Jul 22, 2015 16:54:03 GMT -5
jenneyacres, if I understand you correctly this is no problem at all. Your current animals are all registered with PDCA. You dont need to register them with the ADCA. All you need to do is genotype your current sire and the resulting offspring can be registered with the ADCA.
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